Invisible Memory

[sigi]

Hello,
I might have found the origin of the problem.

I had thought that none of my devices uses memory mapping in the address space between 3GB and 4GB.
Now I found out from the Device Manager that my Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT uses 288MB of memory mapping starting at 3072MB.
I therefore can't create a ramdisk of 1GB, but only of 736MB.

If I create a ramdisk of 736MB, does VSuite allocate from the top (4GB) downward?
Or do I need to use in addition "Change IM Settings" and "Reserve first 288MB Invisible Memory"?

Assuming that this solves the problem, is there any advantage to use FAT32 over NTFS?

A suggestion: couldn't VSuite check in the Device Manager which address space is already used for memory mapping?

[sigi]

Unfortunately, the problem persists as before with this configuration:

[support]

Hi sigi,

Now I found out from the Device Manager that my Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT uses 288MB of memory mapping starting at 3072MB.

This may not overlap IM. This part is right in its PCI/PCI-X reserved MMIO space which is the reason why we normally can't see full 4GB RAM.

VSuite Ramdisk allocates from the start of IM, so if you think your video overlap IM, you may try reserve first 288MB or more.

Actually memory mapping from the Device Manager is not the one that conflicts with IM. As IM is not managed by OS, memory mapping displayed in the Device Manager is not in the IM space.

[support]

Hi sigi,

We saw the figures you uploaded are not in good colors. Is it because your video is not working correctly?

If possible, could you please test the case that don't enable IM? (restart needed to remove all the previous effects to make a clean test)

Thank you very much.

[sigi]

Hello,
did I understand you right that my Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT does not use any "real" memory when memory mapping and that I really have a full 1024MB Invisible memory available for ramdisks?
Please reply to this important question.

My Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT has 512MB dedicated video memory and can request up to 1279MB of system memory by its TurboCache function.
If it does request system memory, will that be from below 3GB, that is from Vista-32 managed memory?

Don't worry about the colors of the screen prints. I use Vista Aero, so the screen prints show by transparency the windows behind the one I am copying.

Rather than following your suggestion to use a non-IM ramdisk for ReadyBoost, I created a configuration using FAT32 instead of NTFS.
For the moment, things seem to run fine.

I join the screen prints.

I specified "Reserve first 320MB Invisible Memory" in case Nvidia uses 288MB for memory mapping.
I created a B ramdisk for the Temp and Firefox Temp files, using NTFS and Direct I/O.
I created an R ramdisk for ReadyBoost, using FAT32 and SCSI.
Does that look good to you? Can I do any better?

Are both ramdisks located above 3GB+288MB, that is above an eventual memory mapping zone for Nvidia?

Why does the Location column say 3:0:0:0 and 3:0:1:0 for the two ramdisks?

I hope we are making progress.
Best regards.

[support]

Rather than following your suggestion to use a non-IM ramdisk for ReadyBoost, I created a configuration using FAT32 instead of NTFS.
For the moment, things seem to run fine.

Glad to hear that. Waiting for the further running result.
It looks that this case is quite simliar to that one we mentioned at
viewtopic.php?f=21&t=380
So if possible, could you try the test that enable everyone's permission (full control) on NTFS and set ReadyBoost to the NTFS ramdisk.
(property mode->change File System from FAT32 to NTFS ->then click "More" button, tick "Set Permissions for Everyone" option and then tick "Full Control" option, click "Set" button -> click"Modify" button->restart the computer to take effect)

Regarding the "Temp and Firefox Temp files", I would like to emphasize a possible case that mentioned before,

Sometimes TEMP folder requires quite much disk space, especially when you downloading files from the internet or view online videos. (It may fail to download the full files from the internet if there's no enough space on ramdisk when you redirect internet temporary folders or TEMP variables to the ramdisk.)

I am a little afraid that the disk space of B ramdisk may not be enough. But anyway it depends on your actual application.

"Location" is used by us internally, and normally it is showed in the format "x:0:y:0". You may just notice the value of y and think it as an index of the created ramdisk.

did I understand you right that my Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT does not use any "real" memory when memory mapping and that I really have a full 1024MB Invisible memory available for ramdisks?

Yes, I think this 288MB range is actually mapped to the video memory on the video adapter, not the physical system RAM.

My Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT has 512MB dedicated video memory and can request up to 1279MB of system memory by its TurboCache function.
If it does request system memory, will that be from below 3GB, that is from Vista-32 managed memory?

I just worried about this "1279MB" part. Whether it is allcoated from managed memory or from invisible memory sometimes depends on how the video driver is programmed. Normally i shall say it is allocated from managed memory.
For your reference, you may visit this page, viewtopic.php?f=21&t=480

Thank you very much for your kind support.

[sigi]

Thanks for assuring me that I can use the full 4th GB of main memory for ramdisks and that my Nvidia GeForce 8600M GT does not interfere with that.

Don't worry about the size of the B disk. Firefox temp is limited to what I tell it for its browser cache size (96MB), it probably erases the oldest files when it needs more space.
The temp variables never went beyond 64MB. In any case, I will adjust when needed.

I could not follow your suggestion
"(property mode->change File System from FAT32 to NTFS ->then click "More" button, tick "Set Permissions for Everyone" option and then tick "Full Control" option, click "Set" button -> click"Modify" button->restart the computer to take effect)"
as I did not find this on the properties of the ramdisks.
Please precise if you think this will advance your debugging.

On the other hand, if using FAT32 instead of NTFS makes it work, I don't mind.

I have now 3 ramdisks for the tests with ReadyBoost:
1) with FAT32, I experienced a system freeze, and had to force power-down
2) with NTFS, still the problem with "System – NT Kernel & System" using 50% of the CPUs during 10 seconds while doing nothing else. For example:
- after loading ReadyBoost for the first time (already mentioned)
- after opening a pdf with Acrobat, with Acrobat already running
- after copying some data into a ramdisk
3) right now, I am running ReadyBoost on a FAT32 ramdisk, using "visible" memory;
the phenomenon has not occurred (yet?)

Please let me know if I can help you any further.

[sigi]

Can you tell me what the "System – NT Kernel & System" task is doing and whether VSuite Ramdisk is calling this task?

[support]

hi sigi,

Thank you very much for your kind support.

I could not follow your suggestion
"(property mode->change File System from FAT32 to NTFS ->then click "More" button, tick "Set Permissions for Everyone" option and then tick "Full Control" option, click "Set" button -> click"Modify" button->restart the computer to take effect)"

Sorry, I didn't describe it clear. I attached the sample picture for you.
The test is just to check if the security settings of NTFS causes this issue. So,
1) enter the property mode and change the file system from FAT32 to NTFS. (if the ramdisk is already in NTFS format, then skip this step.)
2) click the "More" button, a dialog will pop up. (version 4.2.xxxx.xxxx required)
3) tick "Set Permissions for Everyone", and "Full Control" opiton in the popped-up dialog.
4) click "Set" button to save the changes and close the dialog, returning to the main UI of the property mode.
5) click "Modify" button to save above changes.
6) restart the computer to make the changes effective. After reboot, the ramdisk will be in NTFS format and everyone has full control permission to the ramdisk.

fs-settings.png (63.79 KiB) Viewed 2539 times

"System – NT Kernel & System" counts the activties of all the system services and drivers in Kernel mode, including our drivers. Can't know which one causes 50% cpu unless entering Windows' debug mode...

BTW, we are preparing the next release, fixing some possible BSOD/hang.

[sigi]

Hello,
Sorry for the misunderstanding, I was looking for "properties" in the Widows Explorer instead of in Vsuite Ramdisk.

I did what you requested. Following observations:

System just rebooted, nothing running except the task manager and Windows Explorer with My Computer.

I go to Properties of the 544MB NTSC ramdisk with "Set Permissions for Everyone" and "Full Control" and I enable 510MB of this ramdisk for ReadyBoost.

Right away, the HDD activity light goes on, and "System – NT Kernel & System" goes rapidly to using between 45% and 55% of the CPUs, and this during 64 seconds.
Then, when the HDD activity light goes off and for another 40 seconds, "System – NT Kernel & System" uses 50% of the CPUs.

Only then, 104 seconds after establishing ReadyBoost on that ramdisk does my laptop become idle again.

I hope this information helps you with your debugging.